Difference between revisions of "RogueBasin talk:Community Portal"

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== Game Announcements ==
== Articles unnecessarily protected. ==
If you have a new game/version/release to announce to the world, Make an edit to the [[News]] page, and please follow the existing format. If you want to generate discussion and receive feedback and comments, make sure to head over to [http://roguetemple.com RogueTemple] and use their forums, as well as [[rgrd]]. [[User:Stu|Stu]] 14:21, 16 May 2008 (CEST)


Several pages are marked as protected and it's unclear why. [http://roguebasin.com/index.php/Special:ProtectedPages?namespace=0&type=edit&level=0&size-mode=min&size= You can see them here].
There no specified reason, I couldn't find any indications of abuse,
and some of the discussions concluded that the protection was accidental and that admins weren't able to get around to resolving them at the time.[http://roguebasin.com/index.php/Talk:CreatingAForest]
It's obvious why [[Main Page]] and [[Featured roguelike‎]] would be protected, but I think protections should be removed from all other pages unless a reason can be given. --[[User:HexDecimal|HexDecimal]] ([[User talk:HexDecimal|talk]]) 07:26, 22 June 2021 (UTC)


: It seems most of these came from a rgrd thing where people would agree to share their articles in roguebasin but specified they didn't want edits. I will dig into it and put the real cause if that's the case. --[[User:Slash|Slash]] ([[User talk:Slash|talk]]) 16:19, 22 June 2021 (UTC)


== Link breaks wiki, News at 11 ==
:: I didn't realize that.  It's unfortunate that several of those pages have minor errors which can't be fixed.  If that's the case then I think it'd have been better to have external links to the original articles instead of mirroring them on the wiki, or at least segregate them in some way that makes it clear that they aren't normal wiki pages.
:: I found the [[RGRD Wiki Project]] page which mentions that the pages would be protected.  These pages were supposed to have the author info in a small template but that seems to be missing from the protected pages I checked.  --[[User:HexDecimal|HexDecimal]] ([[User talk:HexDecimal|talk]]) 22:31, 22 June 2021 (UTC)


The following link (from 'dead-end pages') fails to display anything other than nasty error messages. Possibly due to illegal characters in title?
== Can't upload new images. ==


http://roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org/index.php?title=Hansj%3F%84%E2%80%9A%3F%82%C2%B6rg_Malthener
I wanted to upload a new image example for [[Scrolling map]] but I receive the following error when I attempt to upload it:
: Could not open lock file for "mwstore://local-backend/local-public/c/c8/Camera_vectors.png". Make sure your upload directory is configured correctly and your web server has permission to write to that directory. See https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Manual:$wgUploadDirectory for more information.
--[[User:HexDecimal|HexDecimal]] ([[User talk:HexDecimal|talk]]) 00:41, 22 August 2021 (UTC)


Other 'bug'ish news. [[SDL]] exists, but searching for SDL will return zero hits. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
:I get that error too. Sorry, not something I can help with. Could be connected to the upgrade in July. [[User:Slash|Slash]], can you look into this please.-[[User:Muscles|Muscles]] ([[User talk:Muscles|talk]]) 02:24, 12 September 2021 (UTC)


The error with Hansjoergs page are not because of illegal characters in the URL. They should be valid even though they look like at least twice encoded in Unicode. There seems to something terrible broken recently with non 7-bit characters. Database update maybe? Try searching for any special character like e.g. '????' (U+00C4 "LATIN CAPITAL LETTER A WITH DIAERESIS" if it gets mangled). Even the db search bails with an error. --[[User:Bhaak|Bhaak]] 15:58, 23 March 2009 (CET)
:: This is fixed now --[[User:Slash|Slash]] ([[User talk:Slash|talk]]) 14:44, 8 November 2021 (UTC)


== That Role Playing ==


== All those guides! ==
Hi, my name is Eugenia, we'd like to add our released game That Role Playing to RogueBasin database of RL games.


Where did all those good guides at http://www.roguelikedevelopment.org/ go? according to the news, the content has been moved to this wiki but I can't find any of those guides! me want's 'em badly!
Steam link: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1673180/That_Role_Playing/
[[User:Solarnus|Solarnus]] 11:28, 16 January 2008 (CET)
Released: 21 Oct 2021
:Sorry, I meant of course that alot of guides are missing, as least most of the map algorithm stuff previously found on the old site is missing here at the wiki. Anyone got copies of those guides, please? [[User:Solarnus|Solarnus]] 14:28, 23 January 2008 (CET)
::And you looked in the map section of [[Articles]]? All the ones I recall are there. Perhaps you can use the wayback machine to calculate which ones seem to be missing? [[User:Duerig|Duerig]] 17:12, 23 January 2008 (CET)
:::lol, the wayback what..? No, realy, I know there's alot missing from the site. Some examples are the guides written by Mike Anderson (Dungeon-Building Algorithm, Fractal Landscapes) and Radomir "The Sheep" Dopieralski (Recursive LvL Generation) [[User:Solarnus|Solarnus]] 17:52, 23 January 2008 (CET)
::::Look at this URL. It is from www.archive.org, the wayback machine for the Internet: http://web.archive.org/web/20060114055601/http://roguelikedevelopment.org/ but before you go adding all of the articles to the wiki, you should know that there was some effort to move them over, but only if the original authors could be found to give permission. So you should check with an admin here about what to do. [[User:Duerig|Duerig]] 08:50, 24 January 2008 (CET)
:::::Oh crap, I thought I could just go and add what I managed to find, since it had already been released on the site o.0' Pardon me, I'm too quick sometimes, doing stuff without thinking first. <br /> But, IMHO, not moving over all that stuff just because the original author couldn't be found kinda buggers me, that's just wast of time and good knowledge, stupidlly forcing to "reinvent the wheel". And it buggers me even more, since obvisiouly (spelling?) it can still be found on the web thanks to that wayback machine you're talking about (thanks for that link btw, would've never thought of that). <br /> Thanks for telling me dude, I'll try slowing down/backing off and poke an admin about it before doing anything else.<br /> <br />Anyway, should the "previously missing" [[Dungeon-Building Algorithm]] article I dug up yesterday be removed, or just leave it for now and hope for the better? [[User:Solarnus|Solarnus]] 13:50, 24 January 2008 (CET)


[...]


::::::Is there any chance of the articles being reposted on the original site until they can be ported here? They're only text documents, and a number of them were very good references. Most of the original files are not stored on wayback machine, so forn ow they are lost for good. [[User:lapoubelle|lapoubelle]] 30 April 2008
: Please feel free to create a game page for it, it looks relevant for roguebasin. Thanks! --[[User:Slash|Slash]] ([[User talk:Slash|talk]]) 14:44, 8 November 2021 (UTC)


I have spent most of today searching for and collecting all of the articles that were on the old system but not on roguebasin. I was able to recover all but two. Those two and links to the archives are at [[User:Duerig]]. That way they should be safe until we can decide how to handle them. If the admins have a problem with this, I'll host them on my own domain if I have to. Let me know if you can find information on either of the two remaining articles. [[User:Duerig|Duerig]] 21:53, 1 May 2008 (CEST)
:: I've created the page. Thank you! --[[User:Enginya|Enginya]] 05:19, 9 November 2021  (UTC)


== False assumption on the front page ==


 
“Modern traditional roguelikes often shun this aspect, in favor of accessibility for less hardcore players.”
 
This statement makes a generalizing and false assumption. Popular modern roguelikes like DCSS, Qud and ToME certainly don’t use graphics as an accessibility feature, nor are these graphics in any way a hindrance to “The True Experience”, as a genre gatekeeper would suggest. Qud in particular is fantastically enhanced via its graphics. It leaves others in the dust when it comes to art style and UX design. Definitely not a mere accessibility feature meant as scrap for the dogs. Let’s excise this subjective and obviously loaded language from the front page.
== Game or project? ==
 
Template [[Template:Angband-variant]] asks for status field. Then game entry is added to "status games" category. This works well for stable games and defunct games but fails for alpha, beta and talkie talkie *projects*. Thus any Angband variants which classify themselves as having alpha or beta status do not get included in proper category. Any ideas how to correct that without destroying too much existing work? I would opt for removing status field and adding all variants to categories manually. Other choice is to spilt template into several like it was done with [[Template:Gameinfo]]. What are others opinions on this? <b><i>[[User:Ancient|–Michal Bielinski]]<sup>[[User_talk:Ancient|Talk]]</sup></i></b> 16:18, 19 August 2008 (CEST)
 
: I think the best bet is to split the template like the Gameinfo did.  I presume there was a good reason to do that split rather than use the status field cleverly.  I don't like people having to manually add the category tag as that will result in people forgetting to categorize the variant at all.  --[[User:JeffLait|JeffLait]] 05:21, 21 August 2008 (CEST)
 
:: Foundations are lain. I am going to wait some more time before proceeding to change all Angband variant pages in case better ideas show up or someone has objections. <b><i>[[User:Ancient|–Michal Bielinski]]<sup>[[User_talk:Ancient|Talk]]</sup></i></b> 15:03, 25 August 2008 (CEST)
 
== 1krl ==
 
We should add this to the wiki, but I'm not sure where.
http://1024brl.googlepages.com/
(and a link to the rgrd posts of course.
--[[User:Soyweiser|Soyweiser]] 02:00, 22 August 2008 (CEST)
 
== Rule of thumb for new -> old news? ==
 
How many months (or how many posts) should be in [[News]] before you should move some to Old News? I would suggest that four months or so is enough as the 'News' section is currently longer than the rest of the Main page. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
:I think that we should move all news from 2008 to Old News. We actually don't really need the [[News]] page to show news older than a month, as it is intended to show '''new''' releases. I will move all news from 2008 now. [[User:Nate879|Nathan Stoddard]] 22:34, 22 March 2009 (CET)
 
== More bug-ish behaviour - support for unicode/multi-byte characters ==
 
I've just noticed that Japanese text typed in my user page spontaneously changed into gibberish (technically 'mojibake' ;-).  The interesting point is that '''initially''' it displayed properly, only after a day or two did it turn into unintelligible characters.  Similar behaviour can be seen at [[POWDER/Russian translation]].  For test purposes I will now write something in Japanese. ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
: My bet is someone used a browser that didnt handle jis/utf or whatever encoding properly and saved it back... your test string is nothing but ?????? to my browser... (ff3.5) [[User:Stu|Stu]] 19:59, 10 July 2009 (CEST)
:: Nope.  Because it happens to me and Japanese works just fine with Firefox elsewhere (including other wikis).  I should test whether it still happens on the new Mediawiki version. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
:: Testing now ... ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????[[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
:: Nah, it still stuffs up. :-( [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
::: Will see what I can do tonight --[[User:Slash|Slash]] 13:53, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
::: I believe it may be down to encoding on the MySQL database - it may need switching to unicode (UTF-8, off the top of my head?) as what is probably happening is that it's being munged into single bytes which make no sense. [[User:Scautura|Scautura]] 13:58, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
 
== talkie = pre-alpha / planning ? ==
 
The 'talkie' category appears to be a little off compared to the line-up of "alpha, beta, stable".  Should I understand it to include games that are pre-alpha / planning or should "pre-alpha" be a new category? 
 
A significant number of 'alpha' projects include no download.  I was under the impression that 'alpha' meant that you could run it and see something even though it might not be a playable game yet. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
:Yes, I think that games that are in 'alpha' but have no downloads should be moved to 'talkie'. [[User:Nate879|Nathan Stoddard]] 23:23, 12 April 2009 (CEST)
 
== Image uploads? ==
 
I see that file uploads are disabled.  I'd like to be able to upload a few small icons for alpha/beta/stable/defunct (after I find/create them ;-).  If I can't do it myself, is there an admin who I could email or something? [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
:It's not possible to upload files, but you can use images from other sites. Put the image's URL on the page, without any special formatting (look at [[Downfall]] for an example). If you need a site to upload to, I recommend [http://imgur.com/ Imgur]. [[User:Nate879|Nathan Stoddard]] 23:26, 12 April 2009 (CEST)
 
 
== 'roguelikes' section of Main page. ==
 
I think that ''influential'' would be clearer (and less controversial) than ''popular''. There are arguably many recent roguelike games that are more popular than ToME, but few (if any) that have been more influential. 
 
I suggest that [[Major roguelikes|Major Roguelikes]], [[Roguelike Reviews]], [[Tree of roguelike evolution]], and [[Recently Updated Roguelikes]] be added to the 'inclusion' page [[list of roguelikes|Lists of Roguelikes]], and the text changed as below:
 
<nowiki>= Roguelikes =</nowiki>
Many Roguelikes are freely available online. The most <strike>popular</strike> influential are:
 
<div style="text-align:center">[[ADOM]] '''·''' [[Angband]] '''·''' [[Crawl]] '''·''' [[NetHack]] '''·''' [[ToME]]</div>
 
Since the control systems of these Roguelikes are geared towards "expert" players, the novice player may be interested in trying a 'lighter' game like some of the '''[[coffeebreak roguelike]]s''' or just dive in at the deep end and find a '''[[:Category:Roguelike_games|game]]''' to suit you.<strike>. The following may help you find out more:
 
*[[:category:roguelike games|Categorized Roguelikes]]
*[[list of roguelikes|Lists of Roguelikes]]
*[[Major roguelikes|Major Roguelikes]]
*[[Roguelike Reviews]]
*[[Tree of roguelike evolution]]
*[[Recently Updated Roguelikes]]</strike>
 
== Also ... ==
 
See [[Talk:List of roguelikes]] for possible replacement for the content of that page. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
== Location instead of Nationality? ==
 
In the developer info, I think it would be more fun to have a Location option instead of a Nationality option. With location, people can put in however much information on their location they want. They could type things like "Sacramento, CA, USA" or just "Arizona, USA" or even "France". The Nationality field limits this information purely to the country where the person is from, which in many cases might not be as interesting as the state in that country that the person lives in.
 
So, the advantage with using the word Location instead is that it provides people the flexibility to put in however much or little information they want, and it can still contain the exact same information that Nationality does. Also, upgrading is easy because we can just replace all instances of Nationality with Location. Although this might be considered a minor issue because people can enter their state and so on into the Nationality field, the Nationality field still encourages new contributions to contain as little information as possible on the location of the developer. Renaming it Location would encourage them to put in as much information as they wanted to. - [[elig]]
 
: I'm not hard against it, but it doesn't sound that great a move.  I doubt the excitement would keep you awake at nights if I told you that I live in Wiltshire now but Berkshire before I moved. ;-) States are mostly only going to be interesting if you happen to live in the same country.  That said, go ahead and do it if you want, it's no big deal either way. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
: The biggest problem with this is that every developer would have to change their developer info. It would be better to create a new template with the nationality changed to location, but then some developers would have a "location" field and others would have a "nationality" field, which could be confusing. I don't think it's worth it to change it. [[User:Nate879|Nathan Stoddard]] 00:38, 8 May 2009 (CEST)
 
== Important links on front page? ==
 
What about having some closely related important community links on the front page? There are very few major resources aside from Roguebasin, pretty much just Temple of the Roguelike, the rgrd newsgroup, #rgrd and Temple of the Roguelike's forums. The RGRD links are currently under articles, perhaps for lack of a better place. They're not articles and it seems a little confusing to me to have them under there. Links might be appropriate, but since there are so few other major resources for the roguelike community, why not highlight them directly on the main page? I feel this would really help people who find Roguebasin for the first time to enter the community. At least, I think all these links should be placed in a single location that is easy to access and properly labeled. Thoughts? - [[elig]]
 
I have now added this to the front page, to show how I think it might look. Feel free to take it off ofcourse if you absolutely hate it, but I think it could be a valuable addition to the front page. Thoughts? - [[elig]]
 
A few [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
# Although I like "Temple of the Roguelike" it doesn't really need two links.
 
# r.g.r.d Newsgroup and R.G.R.D IRC Chatroom could have direct links as well as (instead of?) the links to RogueBasin pages.*
 
# angband.oook.cz deserves a mention.
 
# You've just stolen the space I wanted to use for the "Featured game section" ;-)  (But I can't complain too much as I didn't take the time away from [[Angband/65]] development to feature even one game)
 
NOTE: r.g.r.d Newsgroup should probably have a Google groups link - many people won't have a browser that supports things like news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.pocketpc. If there was a browser equivalent for IRC:// I'd probably say the same about that.
 
Also note that there's a "links" link at the top of the page.  I'd suggest that page could be made more user-friendly and updated.
 
 
Featured games is a good idea. We can always put it above or below the community links. But it should definitely have a featured games thing on the front page. The other changes are all good, I'll probably just leave the Temple of the Roguelike forum, since this page already has news physically on it. The r.g.r.d. newsgroup should be a direct google link IMO as well. IRC I think it would be better to have a seperate page for, just because there's no easy way to specify an IRC server's address, to my knowledge. I'll also add angband.oook.cz - [[elig]]
 
I've also added a temporary space for the future featured Roguelike section. Feel free to remove/edit it of course. Just figured I'd reserve the space :) Also, feel free to put it above the Roguelike community links if you want. Also, what about having the featured roguelike at the very top of the page? Like, in the space where "What is a Roguelike?" is now, with "What is a Roguelike?" right below it? It might be something neat to entice any new visitors to try a Roguelike. - [[elig]]
 
== Specific games.. ==
 
''"I don't think we should have links to sites about specific games"''
 
http://angband.oook.cz/ is not about a single game, it is about an entire genre of roguelike games.  As evidenced by the fact that there are 82 *band variants in the [[List of Angband variants]].  There are at least as many posts on variants as on 'vanilla' Angband and frankly it gets more traffic than http://www.roguetemple.com/ by a long way. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
:Okay. From the description of the site, I assumed it was primarily about Angband. I didn't even look at the site. I will re-add it. :) [[User:Nate879|Nathan Stoddard]] 21:50, 14 May 2009 (CEST)
 
== Reorganize site? ==
 
Right now, this site serves two main purposes: to describe existing Roguelike games and have articles about creating new Roguelikes. I think that at least for the average user, it might be confusing to have the two "mixed" like they are. For example, I think the news section of the main page should be divided into two sections: games and development tools. What do you think? [[User:Nate879|Nathan Stoddard]] 21:54, 14 May 2009 (CEST)
 
: I don't think the development tools should be split out of news, but I do agree that something of a reorganisation is needed.  The site is, IMO, more accessible for game information than it is for development help.  The great majority of game information is in one of two types - 1) Lists and categories, 2) Individual game information.  That is basically all that's needed - ways of finding a suitable game efficiently and information on the game itself. 
 
: Development articles (and related content) are trickier. For one thing I suspect many of the articles may be old fashioned. There are also quite a few articles that are 'locked' (can't be edited).  They are spread around between different languages and I think there are big gaps in difficulty level between them.  What I think would be great would be if there was a series of articles all in the same language (preferably one accessible to new learners and usable on many platforms) that cover all major aspects of development.  Don't worry about having the most efficient algorithms, worry more about understandability and consistency between articles.  Make use of stable libraries if appropriate.  Basically with the intent that someone starting at the first article and finishing at the last could go from newbie to having made a basic functional roguelike game.  That series could form a stable "trunk" and generous inclusion of links to other relevant articles would provide branches off to the details and options that more experienced developers (and those using other languages) will need. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
:: I think that's a good idea. It might be best to use [[Python]], because it is easy to learn, fast to develop in, and portable. It's slow (some say it's 100 times slower than C++), but as you said, efficiency isn't very important. I have some experience with Python, so I could help write some of the articles. [[User:Nate879|Nathan Stoddard]] 01:42, 15 May 2009 (CEST)
 
::: As I understand it the latest version has improved quite markedly in speed, hasn't it? 
 
::: I'm pretty much booked up working on [[Angband/65]] as far as my free time goes up till the end of August so I'm afraid I won't be of much use (and I don't know python). [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
:: Definitely, the game info is far more accessable than the development info. What we're desperately lacking is more information on development, a better organization of that information, and a better way to access that information. I'm not entirely sure how to fix these problems, except for maybe creating a generic Roguelike Development page that is linked to from the front page. Aside from that, I'm not sure. :\ I've thought about adding articles from time to time, but I never know what to name them or where to properly add them. - [[elig]]
 
== Library template(s) ==
 
I've added [[Template:Library]] and applied it to the pages in category:library.  While doing so two points came up to be resolved:
 
1. Should there be -alpha, -beta, -stable and -defunct divisions for libraries?
 
2. Should [[Roguelike Library For Java]] and [[Roguelike Library For Perl]] be changed to use the library template I added?
 
P.S. Feel free to change / or comment on the library template I made. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
: IMO all libraries should follow the same format, and I love the alpha beta stable etc. thing. Sounds good to me! - [[elig]]
:: I also like that curses uses a library like template to specify that curses is a series of libraries. [[elig]]
 
== Who's minding the store? ==
 
That is to say, who is it that does the admin stuff like delete pages in the delete category, pay for the domain name, update the mediawiki version?  I'm just asking because it would be a real shame if I came back here one day and it was all 404'ed or something. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
Not sure, might be slashie. I was thinking of just such an awful idea myself recently. Maybe we should start some kind of fund to financially support roguebasin. Erowid for instance has a non-profit donation based organization that pays their bills. Of course, we wouldn't be able to do anything nearly so fancy, but a paypal account and the ability to donate might be nice... Thoughts? - [[elig]]
 
:: I just now noticed the PayPal donate button on the lower left side of the page. Is that new? I definitely think it should be given a more prominent place on the website if it is! Maybe a nice spot on the front page, and one on the left right under the logo, maybe. Glad to see this place has a donate button now, though! Everybody donate! :D [[elig]]
 
::: That's been there forever.  Before everybody donates I think someone should email the address shown and see if you get a reply. (I don't think Bjorn has edited anything here all the time I've been here?). [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
:: This is being discussed at http://www.roguetemple.com/forums/index.php?topic=413 , thanks for your interest! --[[User:Slash|Slash]] 07:18, 2 July 2009 (CEST)
 
== Wiki backup / duplicate? ==
 
With the current situation (not sure who runs RogueBasin, not sure who has the admin account for the wiki, out of date mediawiki version) would it be possible for someone to duplicate / backup the wiki content?  Worst case it wouldn't all be lost if it goes south.  Best case someone might be willing to set up a new host with better spam-protection and less bugs. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
::I agree, it would be a great benefit to the entire community if we were able to duplicate/mirror this wiki. If anyone could duplicate it, we could set up some mirrors in case the main site ever goes down. Plus, this has the added advantage of independent members of the community being able to download a backup copy. We definitely need an easy way to mirror/download/backup Roguebasin, IMO. [[elig]]
 
::: There's a special page for Exporting pages for import to another '''MediaWiki''' wiki.  [[Special:Export]].  Not sure how well it works.  Or you can ''just'' manually copy each page source. Possibly to a wiki host like PBWorks ??? [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
:::: I have written/grabbed a few scripts to begin automating the backup process and I've also used them to make a complete backup of the roguebasin wiki. Both the scripts and the initial backup are available in a package at: EDIT: Download scripts at http://www.xmission.com/~tyrecius/roguebasin-backup-scripts.zip and backup at: http://www.xmission.com/~tyrecius/roguebasin/backups/ /EDIT  so grab a copy and keep it just in case. If somebody feels ambitious, they can finish automating the process. [[User:Duerig|Duerig]] 07:05, 2 July 2009 (CEST)
:::: This is awesome, Duerig! This is exactly what we needed! :D Thank you. I'm going to download it right away. [[elig]] Edit: After having downloaded it, this really is EXACTLY what we need. This is fantastic. Everyone should download this. [[elig]]
 
::::: Ha-ha, maybe not *everyone* (surely there are bandwidth concerns?).  But great news and thanks Duerig.  I have just downloaded it and will experiment with how easy it is to set-up elsewhere. (It's not a backup until you've tested the restore process! ;-)  I'll report in the Temple of the Roguelike thread. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
:::::: Given your enthusiasm, I decided to bite the bullet and finish automating the process. Download the scripts and run 'backup.sh' and everything will be done for you including downloading the actual xml files and compressing them into a tarball with the current date. I converted a piece of my webspace into backup storage and I've set up a cron job to make monthly backups and stash them there. Fully automated backup scripts at: http://www.xmission.com/~tyrecius/roguebasin-backup-scripts.zip and backup index at: http://www.xmission.com/~tyrecius/roguebasin/backups/ I plan to leave things running and available until/unless my provider complains. [[User:Duerig|Duerig]] 09:32, 2 July 2009 (CEST)
 
::::::: Scautura has made the [http://www.roguetemple.com/forums/index.php?topic=413.msg3322#new very generous offer] to supply ad-free wiki hosting.  Depending on whether we get any replies from Bjorn (and what those replies are) I think it might be a good idea to move RogueBasin.  Obviously it will still be a good idea to make regular backups whatever else happens. Otherwise YourWiki looks like a possibility for temporary / emergency backup location.  I'll be waiting a while to see how things proceed before doing more. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
::::::: Duerig comes through once again! This is absolutely amazing stuff, and exactly what we need. Thank you! Now I can start a torrent based on the backups/ directory. This is awesome! :D [[elig]]
 
== Weird error? ==
 
Every time I search for Bjorn or Bergstrom the search crashes. I was trying to figure out when the new paypal button was added by searching for Bjorn Bergstrom and then seeing when he added it. Unfortunately, it crashes. Any idea why? [[elig]]
 
: I've seen this before.  Unfortunately I can't remember the exact reason for the problem (or where I wrote about it) but I think it's got something to do with the content of the pages searched for (possibly related to the way non-ascii characters get messed up). [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
== The Roguebasin torrent! ==
 
Here is a torrent for the most recent backup of the Roguebasin. I'll be seeding it at 50kb/s pretty much forever. Remember, seeding this is completely legal and supports the preservation of the Roguebasin, so please seed!
[http://www.mininova.org/tor/2742707 Get the torrent here!]
 
::You can also save the copy on [http://www.adrive.com/static/storageplans_basic Adrive] or [http://skydrive.live.com Skydrive] --[[User:Pilotpirx|Pilotpirx]] 11:36, 8 July 2009 (CEST)
 
== New spammers ==
Think its time to update the wiki again? or do something with captha or something to lock new users... the spam is coming thick and fast [[User:Stu|Stu]] 17:39, 10 July 2009 (CEST)
 
: It might be best to have an administrator activate each account before it can be used. This would prevent the spam, and there aren't very many new accounts, so it wouldn't be too tedious. Another option would be to disallow accounts with "buy" in the name. We would need an administrator to do either of these, and it would be useful to have more administrators. [[User:Nate879|Nathan Stoddard]] 21:23, 10 July 2009 (CEST)
:: Right its time someone locked new users down until something can be organised. its beyond ridiculous now. [[User:Stu|Stu]] 18:41, 12 July 2009 (CEST)
::: The wiki is currently in a transition period. The old ops had been idle for quite a while (see comments above and linked thread on TotRL). Slash has just recently been given shell access so he can set things up. I believe that he is planning on upgrading the wiki software and take other measures to prevent spam. While he figures out a permanent solution, we should try to keep things as clean as we can. [[User:Duerig|Duerig]] 20:59, 12 July 2009 (CEST)
 
::: Hello people, I was performing the upgrade but I ran into some problems with the PHP version... hope to have it fixed tomorrow -- [[Slash]]
 
: New captcha measures have been installed, I hope we will have a better time with spambots now --[[User:Slash|Slash]] 18:53, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
 
:: The spam seems to have slowed a bit, but it definitely has not stopped. Are you using a generic captcha? Perhaps something that requires some basic knowledge of roguelike games would work better (I know the original Dudley's dungeon used Nethack-based questions and I never saw it get spammed.) [[User:Rdanhenry|Rdanhenry]] 09:13, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
 
::: Revised opinion: This is not working. You either need a different form of captcha or accounts need to be approved by a human. [[User:Rdanhenry|Rdanhenry]] 09:43, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
 
:::: Or possibly more sysops able to block IP ranges (on the technical side, are all those 'fullmassage' spammers from the same IP?) [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
::::: Paul Blay has been appointed as a SysOp, about 330 spammers have been deleted --[[User:Slash|Slash]] 12:27, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
 
::: I am using "reCaptcha", which is a popular captcha plugin (which may not be a good choice, as popular security measures are the first target for spammers), human approval proved to be clumsy in the past, but if the situation scales we will go that way. --[[User:Slash|Slash]] 12:27, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
 
== Roguebasin mediawiki updated to 1.15.0 ==
 
Well, the upgrade is finished. Let's collect all things broken here. --[[User:Slash|Slash]] 22:18, 13 July 2009 (UTC)
 
<s>1. I noticed the images can no longer be referred to using only the url, so we will have to fix them up --[[User:Slash|Slash]] 22:18, 13 July 2009 (UTC)</s> Fixed --[[User:Slash|Slash]] 00:28, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
 
== (re)Captcha is broken! (or not) ==
 
It doesn't matter what you type, the update goes through anyway.  No wonder we've been spammed to heck. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
:In theory, reCaptcha should give you one "known" word, and one "unknown" word, such that there is one word to check against, and one that they are trying to figure out - if the known word is correct, it doesn't matter what the other word is. Sounds like someone's fouled up with the code on their end and neither word matters. [[User:Scautura|Scautura]] 12:01, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
 
:: "reCaptcha should give you one "known" word, and one "unknown" word" Oh, I didn't realize that.  I'm not sure if it's working or not now.  I'll have to check. I just linked 'google' to get a reCapture prompt and it didn't ask for one. o_O???.  Oddly reCapture prompts have been appearing when I haven't added any new URLs. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
: I just tested and reCaptcha is working when creating a new account? and there's no way to edit pages if you dont have one... am I missing something obvious? --[[User:Slash|Slash]] 12:24, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
 
:: I think I was misunderstanding the reCapture system.  Scautura noted that you only have to get one of the words correct, right? I didn't know that. Before I was 'sysop'ed I was getting a reCapture prompt on all edits that added a new external URL.  I was also getting a reCapture prompt on quite a few edits that ''didn't'' add an external URL, but I'm not sure what all that was about. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
== Community Portal ==
 
Unless someone can suggest a reason I shouldn't I'm going to unprotect the [http://roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org/index.php?title=RogueBasin:Community_Portal&redirect=no RogueBasin Community Portal] page, remove the redirect and delete the rather useless stub in [[Community Portal Alias]]. [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]]
 
: I think that's ok --[[User:Slash|Slash]] 14:42, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 
: Um... the roguebasin itself has a reason. When Jeff last tried to do it his attempts were thwarted by data base error. I would be surprised and grateful if you somehow managed to make it happen. <b><i>[[User:Ancient|–Michal Bielinski]]<sup>[[User_talk:Ancient|Talk]]</sup></i></b> 11:41, 23 August 2009 (UTC)
 
:: Well, I'm back and I finally did it. Now we just need to know what actually goes in a [http://roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org/index.php?title=RogueBasin:Community_Portal&redirect=no RogueBasin Community Portal]. :-P [[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]] 09:27, 7 May 2010 (UTC)
 
== NetHack poll news-worthy? ==
 
Is the [http://nethack-de.sf.net/poll.html NetHack poll for current and former player] a news-worthy item?
 
The news section is labelled 'New Roguelike Releases' so I guess rather not? --[[User:Bhaak|Bhaak]] 11:46, 9 November 2009 (UTC)
 
[[elig]]: I think usually temple of the roguelike handles news related stuff like that. Although, maybe we should have some kind of a more general news feed on here? What does everyone else think?
 
== Template change suggestion for handling released / updated data ==
 
In an effort to a) make the data for 'updated' and 'released' more consistent and b) make it easier to handle by the IRLDB I'm going to suggest splitting up the 'updated' and 'released' information into two fields each.  One for the date, and one for the relevant version number.
 
See [[Brogue]] and [[Template:Game-stable]] for how this could work.
 
This would also be a good opportunity to decide on a common date format.  I would suggest that
 
a) Years have four digits (yyyy) - anything less is just confusing now.
 
b) Months are in letters, not digits (mmm) - no chance of confusing with day-of-month
 
c) day of month is displayed without the NNth NNst NNrd, etc., notation - saves space.
 
For me that gives the prime candidates as ...
 
Mar 12, 2009
 
or
 
2009 Mar 12
 
Advantage of first option - Arguably looks nicer
 
Advantage of second option - Year is first so it will sort nicer in text sorting.
[[User:PaulBlay|PaulBlay]] 09:20, 7 May 2010 (UTC)
 
: [[User:Ido|Ido]] Go for it! 12:02, 13 July 2010
 
: If you want a date with the year in front don't do "2009 Mar 12". It looks ugly as hell and is extremely uncommon. The only reasonable leading year format that is also widely used would be ISO 8601: "2009-03-12". --[[User:Bhaak|Bhaak]] 10:19, 13 July 2010 (UTC)
 
 
 
== Copyright status of pages edited ever since the wiki stopped telling editors that they GFDL their edits ==
 
Hi all,
 
RogueBasin has sometimes required contributors to release their work under the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Free_Documentation_License GNU Free Documentation License] and sometimes not. So what's the effective copyright status of the pages here?
 
[[RogueBasin:About]] says this wiki was hosted at [http://roguebasin.swiki.net roguebasin.swiki.net], then [http://roguebasin.t-o-m-e.net roguebasin.t-o-m-e.net], and now is hosted at [http://roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org].
 
I've tried for a while but haven't managed to get the Internet Archive's [http://web.archive.org Wayback Machine] to show me any part of the wiki as it existed at swiki.net. What copyright license did the wiki use back then?
 
At t-o-m-e.net, RogueBasin indicated that it was GFDLed.  See [http://web.archive.org/web/20060718204357/http://roguebasin.t-o-m-e.net/index.php/Main_Page the Main Page as it was in mid-2006] for example. At the bottom, it says "Content is available under GNU Free Documentation License 1.2." When a MediaWiki-based wiki says that, it almost always MediaWiki tells editors that when they click "Save page", they agree to release their contributions under the GFDL. We can safely assume that RogueBasin did so back then.
 
Here at roguelikedevelopment.org, RogueBasin has no license information at the bottom of the page, and while I'm editing a page, it only says "Please note that all contributions to RogueBasin may be edited, altered, or removed by other contributors. ... You are also promising us that you wrote this yourself, or copied it from a public domain or similar free resource ... ."
 
In [http://www.roguetemple.com/forums/index.php?topic=413.msg3305#msg3305 the "Future of RogueBasin" thread at roguetemple.com], Paul Blay wrote "Articles in RogueBasin are those which are under either the 'GNU Free Documentation License 1.2' (most of them) or a modified version that doesn't allow the content to be modified (a handful or two, I guess).  There should be no problem with copying them to another site as long as they remain under the same license." I think he meant those articles which were posted to Usenet by a single author then copied here later.
 
But many of our pages here, like the [[NetHack]] page and the [[Angband]] page, have been written by many wiki contributors. So, at one point, contributors agreed, when they clicked "Save page", that their work was GFDLed. Later on, further contributors didn't agree to such a thing. The GFDL frowns upon this: it seems to me to require that if you modify a GFDLed work and distribute the modified work (e.g. by saving it on a public wiki server), your changes must be released under the GFDL.
 
What's the copyright status of the pages which were once all-GFDL and now are not?
 
Cheers, --[[User:Unforgettableid|Unforgettableid]] 20:24, 6 October 2010 (UTC)
 
== 4DRL Template ==
 
4DRL Template: There is now a [[Template:Game-4drl|game-4drl]] template for use in the entries to the 4DRL challenge! (use this instead of game-stable, game-alpha, game-7drl, etc.) <small>--The preceding unsigned comment was added by [[User:Nolithius]] [[User talk:Nolithius|(talk)]], 17:57, 28 October 2010.</small>
 
== Shorter repost: Are the pages on this wiki GFDL or not? ==
 
This is a shorter repost of my long post above.
 
In certain years, RogueBasin has required contributors to release their work under the GFDL open-content license. In other years, RogueBasin hasn't required it. So what's the effective copyright status of the pages here: are they GFDL or not?
 
Cheers, [[User:Unforgettableid|Unforgettableid]] 20:19, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
 
: Assume they are not because you cannot divide content that is affected by GFDL from content that is not.
: <b><i>[[User:Ancient|–Michal Bielinski]]<sup>[[User_talk:Ancient|Talk]]</sup></i></b> 04:46, 12 January 2011 (UTC)
 
== Add Prominent IRLDB link into the homepage? ==
 
The International Roguelike Database ( http://www.roguetemple.com/irldb ) leeches data from roguebasin, providing a searchable database as well as allowing rating the games and adding comments about them. Should it be added at the frontpage?
 
http://roguetemple.com/forums/index.php?topic=1476.0
 
: Why not? Sounds helpful, useful, and relevant to me. —[[User:Thomas Larsen|Thomas Larsen]] 01:05, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
 
== Previous medals ==
 
Hi,
 
I've got an 7DRL '10 medal (http://roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org/index.php?title=Pammpi) wich is signed to my old nickname.
Can you guys transfer it to this account or can I do it on my own? Do you need proofs that it's really mine and if so, how can I prove it?
 
I haven't registered to this site previously (or at least I don't think so?:) so they must been taken that nick from my Google groups name.
 
Thanks! :) -[[User:Cujoes|Cujoes]]
 
: Cujoes, you can edit content as you see fit, especially your own medals. Also, please note that while the page [[Pammpi]] has been created, [[User:Pammpi]] does not exist. --[[User:Nolithius|Nolithius]] 18:40, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
 
:: Hi, thank you. :) I didn't realize there's a single button to transfer text to another page, I should've check that before asking any questions.. anyway, problem solved! =) --[[User:Cujoes|Cujoes]] 19:13, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
 
::: No problem. I can move the old page or delete if you would like. If you prefer to leave it with the redirect, that works as well. --[[User:Nolithius|Nolithius]] 22:11, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 10:25, 17 March 2023

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Archives

Articles unnecessarily protected.

Several pages are marked as protected and it's unclear why. You can see them here. There no specified reason, I couldn't find any indications of abuse, and some of the discussions concluded that the protection was accidental and that admins weren't able to get around to resolving them at the time.[1] It's obvious why Main Page and Featured roguelike‎ would be protected, but I think protections should be removed from all other pages unless a reason can be given. --HexDecimal (talk) 07:26, 22 June 2021 (UTC)

It seems most of these came from a rgrd thing where people would agree to share their articles in roguebasin but specified they didn't want edits. I will dig into it and put the real cause if that's the case. --Slash (talk) 16:19, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
I didn't realize that. It's unfortunate that several of those pages have minor errors which can't be fixed. If that's the case then I think it'd have been better to have external links to the original articles instead of mirroring them on the wiki, or at least segregate them in some way that makes it clear that they aren't normal wiki pages.
I found the RGRD Wiki Project page which mentions that the pages would be protected. These pages were supposed to have the author info in a small template but that seems to be missing from the protected pages I checked. --HexDecimal (talk) 22:31, 22 June 2021 (UTC)

Can't upload new images.

I wanted to upload a new image example for Scrolling map but I receive the following error when I attempt to upload it:

Could not open lock file for "mwstore://local-backend/local-public/c/c8/Camera_vectors.png". Make sure your upload directory is configured correctly and your web server has permission to write to that directory. See https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Manual:$wgUploadDirectory for more information.

--HexDecimal (talk) 00:41, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

I get that error too. Sorry, not something I can help with. Could be connected to the upgrade in July. Slash, can you look into this please.-Muscles (talk) 02:24, 12 September 2021 (UTC)
This is fixed now --Slash (talk) 14:44, 8 November 2021 (UTC)

That Role Playing

Hi, my name is Eugenia, we'd like to add our released game That Role Playing to RogueBasin database of RL games.

Steam link: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1673180/That_Role_Playing/ Released: 21 Oct 2021

[...]

Please feel free to create a game page for it, it looks relevant for roguebasin. Thanks! --Slash (talk) 14:44, 8 November 2021 (UTC)
I've created the page. Thank you! --Enginya 05:19, 9 November 2021 (UTC)

False assumption on the front page

“Modern traditional roguelikes often shun this aspect, in favor of accessibility for less hardcore players.” This statement makes a generalizing and false assumption. Popular modern roguelikes like DCSS, Qud and ToME certainly don’t use graphics as an accessibility feature, nor are these graphics in any way a hindrance to “The True Experience”, as a genre gatekeeper would suggest. Qud in particular is fantastically enhanced via its graphics. It leaves others in the dust when it comes to art style and UX design. Definitely not a mere accessibility feature meant as scrap for the dogs. Let’s excise this subjective and obviously loaded language from the front page.

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